Climbing the Mountain of Self-Discovery, Confronting Fear, and Embracing Change with James Robbins
- Savannah Rose Johnson, BA, CLC, RTT.P
- Sep 2
- 28 min read
In this episode of the Eclipse Evolution podcast, Savannah Rose interviews James Robbins, author of 'The Call to Climb.' They discuss the journey of self-discovery, recognizing signs of misalignment in life, and the importance of confronting fears to embrace change. James shares insights from his book, emphasizing the need for inner work and taking back control of one's life. The conversation also explores the power of nature in personal growth and the art of storytelling as a means of conveying deeper truths.
For more information about James, his book, and his website, please visit the links below.
Website: https://www.jamesrobbins.com/
Books:
Nine Minutes on Monday: https://www.amazon.com/s?k=nine+minutes+on+monday&crid=3AHPGSCVYB3ZA&sprefix=nine+min%2Caps%2C395&ref=nb_sb_ss_p13n-pd-dpltr-ranker_3_8
The Call to Climb: https://iwillclimb.com/
Socials:
Instagram: @James.r.robbins
YouTube: www.youtube.com/@james.r.robbins
Facebook: https://www.facebook.com/jamesrobbins97/
Stay Connected with Savannah Rose
Website: www.eclipseevolution.com
Podcast Instagram: @eclipseevolutionllc
Savannah's Instagram: @the_savannahrose
YouTube: @the_savannahrose
TikTok: @the_savannahrose
Desert Books Mentioned in Episode:
Desert Notes: Reflections in the Eye of the Raven by Barry H. Lopez
Desert Solitaire: A Season in the Wilderness by Edward Abbey
Below is the companion video, timestamps, full transcript, and also available streaming platforms.
Thanks for listening!
Chapters:
00:00 Introduction to the Journey
01:26 The Call to Climb: Book Insights
03:53 Recognizing Signs of Misalignment
07:46 Confronting Fear and Embracing Change
11:42 Taking Back Control of Your Life
17:01 Breaking Patterns and Cycles
20:52 The Power of Nature in Self-Discovery
29:12 The Creative Process Behind the Book
Podcast Streaming Platforms:
Companion Video:
Transcript:
Savannah Rose (00:01.582)
Hello, hello and welcome to the Eclipse Evolution podcast. I'm your hostess Savannah Rose. Thank you so much for tuning in wherever you are in the world, whether you're tuning in now or later. We're just grateful to have you, grateful to be on this journey with you. And speaking of grateful, I'm so excited to introduce our special guest, Mr. James Robbins today. He has a very remarkable journey, story, insights. I know you all are going to benefit greatly from what he has to share.
And I hope by the end of this, also check out his new book called A Climb. So I'm very excited and just congratulations on that accomplishment, James, but please introduce yourself and we can get going.
James Robbins (00:42.199)
Savannah, thanks for having me on the show here. Yeah, it's always a struggle introducing myself because I never quite know what to say. But anyways, I grew up on a small cattle ranch in the foothills of the Rocky Mountains. And I've had a couple of different careers along the way. But I guess I'm someone who I love my kids and I see great potential in people. And I just want to help them tap into that.
Savannah Rose (01:09.074)
I love that. And so I want to get started with your book because I'm a fellow author. I'm really excited about that. I would just love to know how that journey has been for you and the inspiration because I know I don't want to spoil it. I'll let it come from your mouth. But I would love to have you share just about how that book came into existence because it's really cool.
James Robbins (01:30.807)
Well, thank you. the newest book is titled The Call to Climb. And it's actually my second book. My first book was a book on leadership, and it's very prescriptive, very corporate. But somewhere in my mid to late 30s, I was working in this job that was a highly purposeful job that everybody would be like, wow, you have like the best job. But at the same time, I was just really unhappy. And I didn't know why, and I just kept pushing through. it's obviously, I'm the problem, because the job's
not the problem, so I must be the problem. So I just kept pushing through. Well, eventually I just crashed and burned. It just had this moment of burnout. And it was during this time that I stumbled upon the work of Dr. James Hollis, who had a book called Finding Meaning in the Second Half of Life. Well, anyways, I was reading this book and he has this theme in there about how at some point, usually in your 30s actually, at some point there is this sort of collision of selves, right? Where the...
The life you've been living, you you come out of college or out of high school and you have all these plans and dreams and you jump in and maybe you have a family. But at some point this other life, this other self collides with it and it's the deeper self and it's the soul actually and it desires to have a conversation with you. But most people will avoid that appointment. And so I was reading these words and I thought, yeah, that's exactly what's happening to me.
But that concept stuck with me and it would be another 15 or so years later before I created a book around that concept, which is what The Call to Climb is. It's about when you start to feel out of alignment with your life or your job or you're asking that question, you know, is this what I'm supposed to be doing or is there more for me? Is there something bigger for me or you feel like there is but you're not quite sure what? And
Those are nudges from the soul wanting to get your attention to have that conversation. But the problem with that conversation is it's a really scary conversation because often it's going to tell you, hey, there's something different for us. There's something better for us, which means a totally different path. So anyways, the book is written in a story form about somebody who stumbles into this remote village in the Bolivian Andes only to find out that they've this this village has been expecting them.
James Robbins (03:53.462)
because they've been called to climb this special mountain where you are in a sense forced to sit down and have a conversation with your soul.
Savannah Rose (04:03.745)
Wow, my gosh, that's rich, that's rich. That soul work, that deep dive. Gosh, I have so many questions for you. Okay, so you were talking about when you're feeling out of alignment and that's kind when your soul is knocking and asking you to listen to it. What did you notice and maybe what advice do you have for listeners on noticing those cues within yourself of, maybe I am starting to step out of alignment. Like what does that feel like?
James Robbins (04:34.091)
Yeah, it's gonna be different in a sense for every person, but some of the things that you wanna look for is when you begin to act out of the norm for you, or maybe you're like really stressed out, or you've got that dead feeling. Like it's one thing to be afraid, it's another thing to be maybe excited, but it's another thing to be dead inside. And often when you're dead inside with a certain job,
We're not talking over a week, but you know, months and months and months go by and there's just a deadness there. That's usually not coming back. And that's usually a sign of, okay, a vacation isn't going to fix this. A sabbatical may not even fix it. Maybe it's, maybe you're being called to different path. For me, there was also some things that were so out of character. Like I'm a pretty, I'm a pretty calm guy. Like I never raised my voice and just don't do that. And I remember one day my daughter's Siberian husky.
Got out of the house and you know if if anyone who knows anything about huskies like once they're gone They're gone like you're gonna see them three months later But I ran out on the street and I grabbed this dog by the scruff of its neck and I pushed it down on the ground and I just shouted at it and it was like this out-of-body moment where I thought who is this like who are you right now like shouting at your dog in the middle of the street and I thought whoa like that's not me and
I think when we are out of alignment for a long time, we just start to act in ways that are not us. It's the stress, it's just the compounding nature of that friction of going down a path we're not supposed to. And if you do that long enough, eventually, I think eventually you will kill that off and you can continue on that path, but in a more deadened form. And that's what I did honestly for years. I just kept going.
And it wasn't until maybe 10 years after that moment that I finally was like, all right, I need to change paths.
Savannah Rose (06:40.599)
So well said. Thank you for that. Wow, that's so insightful and I relate so much to that. think that is one, that overriding of that feeling or like you kind of explained like it must just be a me thing, right? And kind of putting that blame on ourselves for feeling that way, whether it's like dead inside or just acting out of character. I think that that's so relevant to this burnout epidemic that we're in right now. Cause I mean, you are certainly not the first nor probably the last person who's been on this show who has
experienced that burnout that's really been a catalyst for that pivot in life. I'm curious like I know the book really explore this book really explores courage and overcoming fear and I feel like that definitely goes hand-in-hand with making that pivot and becoming more yourself and stepping back into alignment but I think what I have noticed right now in society and maybe and honestly I think it's
it affects all ages is almost this
I would say limited capacity, not because of actual capability, but just a limited capacity for holding fear and holding feelings that are uncomfortable and experiencing that, whether it's sadness or grief. Because think grief also really can come with transitions, even if they're good ones. I think it still shows up in those changes. I'm curious what your experience has been to allow yourself to have that capacity to confront those difficult feelings and make
change.
James Robbins (08:15.255)
Yeah, I agree with you about the fear part and I think I think honestly It's just a universal thing. We're so afraid of we're so afraid of falling out of favor with the tribe I mean when you look at at sort of the hyper successful I'm talking about the the people who have ascended to you know billionaire status a lot of them will have a similar Signature where they were just able to run their path and not worry so much about what people thought of them
And I think for the rest of us, it's a huge struggle. And it starts, you know, obviously when we're young and then parents put these expectations on us, even if they don't realize it. You know, in my family, it was, you've got to go to college. Like if you don't go to college, then you are failing right from the get-go. And so, you know, I went, but I have a sister who didn't, and then spent her whole life feeling like she wasn't smart.
all because of the expectations there and then she had to struggle with that gap. And you know, then we get into, we get into a career and then we think, well, what if I don't like this career, but I can't change, I'm already in and we're still thinking in our twenties, what would my parents think about that? It's really difficult to carve out your authentic path because sometimes, like for me, my father was a lawyer and he ended up becoming a judge and thought it would be a good idea for me to go to law school and
Because he wanted me to go to law school, I wasn't gonna go to law school. It was like, I'm gonna chart my own path. But little did I realize in that moment, he was still, in a sense, controlling my decision because I wasn't choosing not to go to law school because I didn't wanna go. I didn't wanna go because he wanted me to go. In that way, it's really difficult at times to figure out what's really my path. It's the same for goals. For years, I had this goal like,
gotta make a million dollars. It was just this magic number, right? Gotta make a million dollars. And then later I had to ask myself, why do you want that? Like what's the reason behind that goal? And as I sat with that, I realized, I wanna make a million dollars to prove that I made it, which means I don't feel like I've made it now, which means I don't feel successful. And then that's when it hit me,
James Robbins (10:36.811)
The million dollars isn't really about a million dollars. It's about erasing your shame. And so when you start to get really honest about your goals, about what you're trying to accomplish in your life, and then say, what's behind this? Really, what's driving this? And it takes a bit of inner work to do that. You start to get a clearer and clearer picture about what is the soul's intent for you. Right, because the soul seeks expression. It seeks expansion. Your soul's a little bit like the oak seed.
of an oak tree, right? The oak seed just want, it's just gonna become an oak tree. it's going to be that. Now it's gonna do things as an oak tree, but that's not really the goal. The goal is to become the oak tree. And I think our soul is that. It seeks the highest expression of us. And unfortunately along the path is all these obstacles of people's expectations, our fears. But I I think to answer your question about
For me, how did I get over that? It definitely wasn't a quick process. And for me, it was a long process of doing stuff longer than I should have. I think one thing that really helped me was I got away from my environment and I got into, for me, it's nature. I got into nature. And that's when I had a moment and I just asked myself, okay, James, like, what do you want?
and don't judge the answer. And soon as I asked it in that way and in that setting, it's just the answer came. And I was like, okay, I was worried you were gonna say that. All right, then that's what we're gonna do. so, cue the courage at that point, but at least it was clear.
Savannah Rose (12:26.829)
That is so that is so well said and and for my delays in between responding it's because my birds are so chatty right now So I'm meeting myself while you talk because what you're saying is so good I don't want any pieces to get missed but that's so amazing. So I guess what I'm hearing is
This shift in kind of moving through the fear, almost sounds like, yes, listening to the soul, but I would say it sounds to me like a shift in where authority is placed. Because like you were saying, making a decision out of rebellion is still being influenced by something. It's not, I mean, maybe totally being free of that authority in some ways. And then it sounds like when you're listening to your soul path, soul's call, the desires.
really like that desire piece it sounds like is what becomes the new authority in that process and tell me if I'm on the right track with that.
James Robbins (13:25.079)
Yeah, for sure. And you know, the bigger picture to that is, is really taking back control of your life. Because here's the thing, no one is going to give you permission to live your life. Permission is never given. It's taken. And there really is a process of taking back control of your life. Not that, not that any one person is holding that. Well, maybe someone in, know, someone who's listening. Maybe there is someone in your life that's very controlling. But at the end of the day, really to live in freedom.
you've got to take back control. It's a little bit like when you're born, your life's this open book, but everyone starts writing in it before you get a chance to even read. then by the time you're whatever, 16, 17, they hand the book back to you and they're like, okay, this is you. And a lot of it is, but then as you read, you're like, wait a minute, I know if I like that. And real autonomy begins when you start taking the pens back from everyone.
Just going no no I'll I'll write the story from here and I'll write it how I want to write it and I think that's the that's the difficult thing and you have to you have to seize control back of your life and the other thing is you know as you know from your work Savannah so much of what drives us are these unconscious programs that go beneath the surface and for me there was this There was this I can call it a terrifying moment. So I started journaling
a long time ago, maybe back in 2011 or something. I started journaling and I really kept with it. I created this habit and like over a decade, I had like thousands of journal entries. And it was all in this app that I journaled in. Well, maybe six, seven years into this app, they came out with a new feature where when you logged in and it would be like, whatever, September 3rd, and it would say, hey, you have like four other journal entries from September 3rd and prior years. Do you want to review them? And I'd be like, yeah.
what was happening a year ago, two years ago. And so I would go in back and I would read these other entries. And more often than not, I would read the entries and I'd be like, well, that's eerie. That's literally like what I would write today. Some of them were so close to what I would write, like what I just wrote that day, that I even copied and pasted them and I sent them off to a couple of friends. I'm like, hey, check this out. Like, this is weird. And the more I began to review, the more I began to see these
James Robbins (15:50.572)
these big patterns, like scary patterns. Not only like fears, it was like the same struggles, was the same fears, it was the same rock that I didn't get over. And then I began to notice patterns even in what I was doing. This is the weird part. I'm like, I'm in Costa Rica at a hospital and then because I've got stomach pains and that night I go to write my journal only to learn that a year ago on the same date I'm in a hospital in Spain.
getting emergency surgery, getting my gallbladder pulled out, or how one day I go to the doctor because I just couldn't get over this flu, or I was like a CVS Minute Clinic. And then the nurse practitioner starts listening to my symptoms, starts to get ready to type them into my file, and she goes, wait a minute, she goes, you were already in here today. I was like, no, I wasn't. She goes, yes, you were over at our other location at the beach. And I'm like, no, I wasn't. And then she goes, wait a minute.
That's so weird. She goes, you were in one year ago on this same day and all your symptoms are the same. She goes, I'm just gonna copy and paste and put them into today's notes. it was all these moments like that that made me realize, wait a minute, I'm living this copy and paste life. It's like I'm living in this massive orbit that's just so big. It's like the...
how the earth goes around the sun. It's just so big that by the time I get back to the starting point, I don't know that I've been there before. Because if somebody had said like, you're just living in a pattern, James, I'd be like, no, there's no way. I'm so devoted to personal growth and I'm doing all these different things. But no, my life was truly that anonymous quote that says, it's said that a man lives only.
80 years, but in reality he lives only one year, repeated 80 times. And that's our life, unless we break from that pattern. And that takes...
Savannah Rose (17:47.115)
Savannah Rose (17:58.254)
I'm so moved right now. could cry. Just because what you're saying is so potent, so potent, James, and it's so relatable, and it's so funny you mentioned the journaling piece, because I feel like you're so spot on with that, not just as a tool for just...
output and expression, but it's such a massive tool for self accountability really I think because the same as you I've gone through my old journals and try to make a habit of doing it every so often and finding where I was a year ago and if I'm still complaining about the same crap I'm like Who's the culprit? Like I need to actually do something about this. So I'm curious
When it comes to that pivot moment, like when you are seeing the forest for the trees, like, this is something that I am perpetuating. What advice do you have on breaking out of those cycles? And I would say not just the old with the old, but how do you incorporate the new?
James Robbins (19:00.183)
For sure. So you need those moments that sort of catch your attention that, wait a minute, I've been here before. It's a little bit like every year on my birthday on August 12th, there is a meteor shower. And that's me predicting the future. I can tell you that's going to happen. And someone might say, well, it's not really the future because it just happens every year because we're in a loop. But it really is predicting the future.
I can predict the future because we are in a loop. And so it's the same with our lives. if you, especially if you've journaled and you can look back over the last five years and you can see the theme, well, that's the same theme for the next five. And if you don't like that, then something has to interrupt the orbit, right? Otherwise, we're just gonna go all the way around the sun again and we're gonna come back through and have the meteor shower. So.
You have to find a way to catch, wait a minute, I've seen this before. This is me. This is at least my pattern. And then we have to get ready to do the work. And this is why I talk about this in the book and the call to climb. You the metaphor is around climbing a mountain because it does take work. And I don't know. I mean, some people might disagree with me on that, but at least my experience is it takes work and courage to
go inside and think, why am I always people pleasing? Why did I take my friend's puppy for the weekend when I absolutely didn't want to and couldn't? Why did I say yes to that? Why do I lack boundaries? Why do I always feel insecure around this one person? Right? There's all reasons for that. We just don't know because we've not seen, at the surface we only see these tiny little sort of symptoms. But deeper down,
It takes a lot of courage to face these moments where you can think, because I'm afraid of this. because I really care about what people think of me. because I don't believe that I'm enough. And because those statements are so scary for us, we just want to avoid them. But if you can dive deep without judgment, like truly, as you would if as if you were investigating someone else, right? Like you are.
James Robbins (21:22.455)
Think of yourself as a scientist if you're just looking at the data and you're going down. Okay, here's here's the data When you can when you can be okay with those truths I'm not even gonna call them ugly truths because that puts a judgment on it but you could okay with those truths like you know what I I'm I feel insecure around this kind of person because it reminds me of this and it makes me feel inadequate and whatever it is just be okay with the answers and
You know, from there, okay, there's various different ways that you can begin to speak to that part of yourself. But until you deal with some of those things, they're just gonna keep showing up again and again and again.
Savannah Rose (22:05.421)
So true. I'm curious, and this is kind of taking a step backwards to something you mentioned a minute ago about the power of nature. And I know the climbing and the mountains are a metaphor in your book, but also you mentioned that powerful practice of just spending more time in nature. I wrote it down just because I think it's something that...
as a society, and I don't know if this is just exclusive to American society or what, but I'm noticing, especially with this more technological age, just a further and further separation from nature. And I think one of the beautiful things that nature provides is a judgment-free environment. mean, certainly it does test you, but I think that when you're describing...
removing judgment and stepping more into that place of curiosity. think that's something that nature also provides and reassures within us is this place where you're already enough. there's, you're already great as you are, just as nature is great how it is too. I'm curious like what kind of connections you've been able to make in your time out in nature.
James Robbins (23:19.095)
I think nature is a reminder for us. It gets us out of our head and back into our bodies. I'm not sure if this has ever happened to you, but you know, it's one thing to be walking down the street and you're looking at your phone and returning a text as you're walking. But if you ever go into nature and you pull out your phone to do something, there's just something that all of a sudden eventually feels wrong. Like you're like, what am I doing? Like, why am I on this thing? And I'm surrounded by whatever, the beach or the...
ocean or the mountains, it's like this calling you back to like, get off your phone, you know, and, and okay, that's right. And then all of a sudden you're in this moment. I think there's probably a lot more to nature than we understand in the moment in terms of maybe the energy or the frequency. But for me, I think there's part of, there's part of all of us, maybe it's an ancestral part of us that maybe comes online when we get.
out of the city streets and blocks and neighborhoods and just to nature. And it doesn't have to be in the middle of a national park either. It could just be actually in the park in your neighborhood where there's some green grass and some trees. Nature gives you a chance to marvel, right? To marvel and be in awe. And those are, those are, are two kind of two of the same emotions really. Like to be in awe of something that's not a problem. That's not your problem.
that's not something to fix. Like when you get into nature, there's not a problem to solve. There's just a moment to be and be present. So I think it contains just a lot of natural power to be in nature. For me, that's where I can calm down quicker. And then it's as you let things go, right? Then that's actually when things come to you. You start to let problems go.
let worries go. And like I did on that, when I had a really big decision to make and I just said, okay, what do you want, James? And don't judge the answer. And then the answer came.
Savannah Rose (25:33.134)
Absolutely, it's just that letting go.
I feel like it gives yourself more permission to, like you said, not judge. And then when we are freeing those channels, we can attract more because we're not putting those subconscious barriers up. I think expectations is something that personally I'm working through when it comes down to these nature archetypes. I'm really studying the desert right now and how the desert, can seem so...
desolate or empty or even lifeless sometimes, but how really it can
Strip ourselves like when we are embracing the desert archetype. We're stripping ourselves of distraction and expectations and allowing ourselves to just be in a kind of different way than maybe like the the lush forest but just my preference the lush forest provides because there is so much to marvel at but I think you're so right where when we're marveling it's it's a such a pure state of humility in that in that sense of
detaching from the ego, so to speak. Because I think when we're inside and we're on our phone, it's just like this kind of narcissistic world of our existence. But when we're in nature, we're so little and we're coexisting with so much and it's all moving and flowing naturally, literally. And that we can take part of that and also flow and move naturally too.
James Robbins (27:03.383)
You've piqued my interest there about the nature archetypes. I've never studied that out, but as you say that, for me, the mountains are top of my list. There's something about the mountains. It could be that I grew up in them. It could be that my father used to take me into them. In the mountains, feel a sense of awe of how small I am, but I also feel the security, because they're just not moving. They're not going to go anywhere. At the same time,
I saw this YouTube channel the other day, I don't know if you've ever seen it. This guy basically will film him hiking in silence. And it's always, the camera's never on him, but the camera is like, he obviously has to set it up and walk by. Anyways, he has this one video where he just walks across this desert in somewhere in the Middle East, in Jordan, I think, is the Wadi Rum. And I just watched this, there's no talking. And I just watched him walk across this desert. And I just felt his longing for
I want to go there. It was something about the just this vastness of nothing. And it was it called me. So that's why I say you've piqued my interest about the archetypes of nature.
Savannah Rose (28:13.645)
Sure, yeah. Well, the idea came to me because I have this archetype card deck that has all different kinds of cards within it. But I kept in this massive deck of, I don't even know how many cards, I just kept pulling this desert card. And in the little book that comes with the deck, has further exploration and it recommended some books. so normally when I see and pull from this deck,
I won't always explore the continuation piece, but I decided to challenge myself. I'm like, no, this card keeps coming up for me for a reason. I need to dive deeper. And so I bought both of the books and I finished one and I'm in the middle of another one right now. But the first one, it was about how the desert...
Like you were saying, it can just come across as this like nothingness and it almost can make you a little frustrated or angry. And that's the one that the author was exploring where he's like, what is this place? Like, what does this bring me? But then he kind of realized that what's brought to him is this kind of like very crisp, stark, just reality check of squaring up with that relationship with himself where it's like,
when he's looking for something or seeking or kind of looking for that external and putting that authority outwards, it was disempowering. But when he checked himself, checked the expectations, allowed himself to just be present, that's when he realized he had it all. then kind of embodying that and tying that in. Because in the spiritual community, there's kind of this analogy of going through a desert period in life where it can feel like what we're
wanting or trying to achieve is just not there and we're kind of in that same state of like, what the hell? There's nothing here. But kind of to your point where it's when we're able to take that step back and look at ourselves and be like, what am I perpetuating in this moment? Like what's taking me out of the present, out of being able to receive and being honest with that, we're able to actually move through the desert so much faster because we're embracing it rather than resisting it.
James Robbins (30:29.887)
Yeah, that's fascinating. I think when I thought about like, why did I have this strong desire to go to this desert place and I watched that, I think for me, maybe in that day, was like I wanted to be alone and there's no people there. I just had this. So I didn't look much into it. I should more, but yeah, I'll check that out Savannah. It sounds cool.
Savannah Rose (30:50.561)
Sure, yeah, I don't remember the...
Confessed I don't remember the names of the books. I'm kind of out about that But I can send them to you in an email and I can put them in the description as well to this podcast if anyone else wants to explore the archetype alongside your archetype or your metaphor of the climate and Exploring the climb analogy more. I think it's so I feel like it does people such a service to Explain it in that way where this does take work. This is a journey I think that's something that I see in my
James Robbins (30:58.497)
Sounds good.
Savannah Rose (31:22.253)
practice, especially in the psychedelic integration world where people will come to me wanting to do ketamine therapy and they see it as this like silver bullet solution where they're like I'm gonna do this treatment and be fixed and
I have to be so honest with people when they come to me for that where I'm like, hey, that's not what this is for. This is not a take the pill, feel better, fix anything kind of thing. It's more of like that catalyst making your mind a little bit more open to exploring the work that needs to be done. And that's where I come in and helping them do that work. So I think it's so powerful that you are honest about that and provide resources in your book to
guide folks on that climb because I think if we have that expectation still of if I take this and do that It's gonna be that kind of almost transactional movement So I'm curious like where you're at right now and and the climb that has been in releasing this book How has that process been for you? Because didn't it just come out or it's coming out pretty soon?
James Robbins (32:29.347)
It just came out. Yeah, it just came out. So the interesting thing about the book is I had the idea for the concept 10 years ago and I even pitched it to McGraw Hill who had done my first book. They said no. I pitched it to Wiley who they said no, even though now they're the ones publishing it 10 years later. But this is for all of you who are authors or aspire to be authors and they're listening. This is an important point. I'm so glad it got rejected 10 years ago.
Savannah Rose (32:36.289)
me.
James Robbins (32:58.679)
because it would have been nowhere near the book that it is now. It would have been so prescriptive, it would have been like, here's the five shifts and here's the four of this and the eight whatever, here's the eight Ws. in 10 years, that book, the depth of it is incomparable. you know, again, the story is about this character named Riley and she ends up stumbling into this village.
and that's where she meets this guy named Santiago. And right away she can tell there's something different about this guy. And then he basically breaks the news to her like, hey, you've been called here so that you can climb this mountain. And kind of out of the true hero's journey, she rejects the call at first, but eventually she has no choice and she has to climb. And so throughout the climb.
At night time sometimes you will dream on this mountain It's your soul bringing you messages and she she learns that her life is also in this big loop It's in this repeating pattern and the soul craves something bigger for her So the first the first section of the book is really about honoring your path, right? You're here for a reason you're unique for a reason and it's to it's to follow that and then The second part of the book they ended up
they actually end up going underground through a series of unforeseen events. And there's a quote from Joseph Campbell at the start of that section that says, the cave you fear to enter holds the treasures that you seek. And it's all about going inside. And that's where Riley begins to go inward and learn about identity, of the deepest fears, what we call dragons also, sort of these three fears that are just the core core that
These dragons breathe shame. And it's through this process that, you know, eventually she makes her way up the mountain and lots of tests and challenges. But each one is truly a test, not so much physically, but really emotionally, spiritually, mentally at times. And there is a certain grinded culture out there, you know, where you can go on YouTube. I listen to some of these videos from time to time, you know, like,
James Robbins (35:17.887)
get your button gear and get going. And there's a time for that, but you can only do that so long if you haven't done the inner work. And eventually you'll keep sliding back down. Like you'll climb, climb, climb, climb, and then you'll just, just an avalanche will just bring you right back down to where you were. And that gets exhausting unless you change some of the inner programming into the inner work so you can take a different path and you don't.
keep playing this game of snakes and ladders with your life.
Savannah Rose (35:49.454)
Well said. No, I completely agree with you and I think that that's one of those key things to burn out recovery is
working on that conditioning piece that keeps you in that, some people call it type A, I call it like just that like hustle addiction almost. And I think that there's so many different factors that can motivate us to stay in that addiction. It's a cycle like you said. I'm curious, this is more like a creative direction question for you.
given that this book is written from like that storytelling perspective and it's also from a female's point of view too. I'm curious what made you decide to go in that direction.
James Robbins (36:30.699)
to go with the fable format? I think those have been my favorite types of books that I have read. I love reading a fable book when it's a good one. Some of them I find a bit light or a bit, you know, bit cheesy at times, but those are just different, I guess. But they obviously appeal to lots of people. I think for me, I've always been a storyteller and storytelling's always been...
Savannah Rose (36:33.271)
Yes.
James Robbins (37:00.395)
big part of my life. when it came to writing it, I thought this would be better in a story. And you know, I'm not a certified therapist. And so there's certain things I thought, well, I don't know that I can write that in a more prescriptive way. Plus, I think the beauty about a story is that it allows people to take different interpretations that work for them.
So what I mean is, you know, somebody can hear, three people can hear the same story and take three separate points out of it. If you're just writing a book, it's like, no, here's the point. But when you're writing in a fable format, you can be thinking here's the point, but someone else might take something out of it. And there's, case in point, I talked to someone who had read the book really quickly and I was asking, you know, what'd you think, what parts hit you? And there's this...
There's this scene in the book where Riley, the character, they've got to go through this really tight passage underground in a cave and she gets stuck and it's just this terrifying moment. Well, the intention I wrote that with, you know, the person reading it, they just took something totally different. So they were telling me like, when that part where she was stuck in the cave and I thought, yeah, and they talked about the point they got.
And part of me wanted to like say, well, that's not actually the point I was making, but I didn't say that because that's the point, right? For them. And it's true for them. And so I think that's a benefit of writing in a fable format. And it's just a lot more fun, Savannah. Like I knew how the story started and I knew how it ended. I didn't know how it was going to unfold. so for me, just, it was like a great adventure. It's...
Savannah Rose (38:39.213)
Mm-hmm.
James Robbins (38:50.099)
If I write another book that's not a fable, I think it will be a really tough task.
Savannah Rose (38:56.301)
Wow, I hear you and I think that's fantastic because it is such an adventure and it's such, I mean, it's true art, it's true medicine. Like when people go on the adventure of reading this story, like you said, like they'll take from it what they need. And I think that that's such a gift that you provide and leaving it in that very, I would say personal yet just artistic format is because I think that that's one of the
real beautiful things that art provides us is it can mean something at one moment. Let's say they pick it up and read it a year later and it can mean something totally different or reinforce what they learned before. So I think that that's one of the gifts that what you pour into this story, it can have really an unlimited amount of benefit. That's so cool.
James Robbins (39:48.247)
It was a lot of fun. I mean, it was a lot of work, obviously, but it was a lot of fun to write it. yeah, it just it was was enjoyable.
Savannah Rose (39:57.975)
Congratulations again. And so for folks wanting to check out this story and wanting to check you out some more as well, where can people track you down?
James Robbins (40:05.943)
Well the book you can find on all the major retailers, the audio version just came out today also. But if you want to go to a website, go to Iwillclimb.com, so Iwillclimb.com and you can find out about the book resources and more about me there.
Savannah Rose (40:24.173)
Amazing. Well James, thank you so much for chatting with us today. I thoroughly enjoyed it. It very inspiring. I have so many notes written down, so I'm gonna be using these as some journal prompts for myself as well. And to those who tuned in today and down the road as well, thank you so much for your time, your energy, your investment in this show. This is Eclipse Evolution. We've had this wonderful, wonderful guest today, James, and thank you so much. I'm Savannah Rose, and bye for now.
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