The Data on Love & Relationships: Podcast Special Guest Author & Relationship Expert, Zoey Charif
- Savannah Rose Johnson, BA, CLC, RTT.P
- 4 days ago
- 36 min read
In this episode of the Eclipse Evolution podcast, host Savannah Rose speaks with author Zoey Charif about her book on love, self-love, and the analytical approach to understanding relationships. Zoey shares her journey of writing the book, the importance of self-awareness in relationships, and how data analytics can help individuals recognize patterns in their love lives. The conversation delves into the balance between emotional and rational decision-making in love, the significance of self-love, and the dynamics of self-sacrifice versus self-focus in relationships. Zoey also discusses various relationship distortions and how they can impact one's self-worth and relationship health. In this engaging conversation, Savannah Rose and Zoey Charif explore the dynamics of love, self-awareness, and emotional intelligence. They discuss the importance of balancing masculine and feminine energies, understanding attachment styles, and the role of practicality in relationships. Zoey shares insights from her book, emphasizing the significance of self-love and recognizing one's worth in fostering healthy relationships. The dialogue highlights the journey of healing from past relationships and the necessity of emotional regulation in maintaining a balanced partnership.
For more information about Zoey and her book, please see the following links.
Instagram: @zoeycharif
Amazon: https://a.co/d/3MP1yZA
Stay Connected with Savannah Rose
Podcast Instagram @eclipseevolutionllc
Savannah's Instagram @the_savannahrose
Savannah's YouTube Channel @the_savannahrose
Savannah's TikTok @the_savannahrose
Below is the companion video, timestamps, full transcript, and also available streaming platforms.
Thanks for listening!
Podcast Streaming Platforms:
Companion Video:
hapters:
00:00 Introduction to Love and Self-Discovery
02:44 The Intersection of Data and Love
05:22 Recognizing Patterns in Relationships
10:01 The Balance of Emotion and Rationality
13:49 The Importance of Self-Love
19:40 Self-Sacrifice vs. Self-Focus in Relationships
21:12 Understanding Relationship Distortions
28:34 Embracing the Empress Within
30:05 Balancing Masculine and Feminine Energies
33:04 The Role of Practicality in Love
35:57 Understanding Attachment Styles
38:57 The Importance of Self-Awareness
42:57 Healing from Past Relationships
45:50 The Journey of Emotional Regulation
52:04 Recognizing Your Worth
Transcript:
Savannah Rose (00:01.053)
Hello, hello, welcome to the Eclipse Evolution podcast. I'm your host, Savannah Rose. I'm so excited to have you here today. Thank you for tuning in wherever you're tuning in from. I'm so excited that this audience and community has grown to just a global reach. So whether you're tuning in from the UK or from Canada or Poland, wherever you're tuning in from, thank you from the bottom of my heart. And thank you as well to my amazing guest today, Zoe Sharif. I'm so excited to have her.
Zoey (00:03.694)
you
Savannah Rose (00:31.187)
Not only is she lovely if you're viewing us via video just in the few minutes we've connected in the green room She's just been a delight and I think that her background is extremely interesting as well as her book that she recently published and I can't wait for her to share more about herself her Expertise and I know you all are gonna gain some amazing with nuggets of wisdom So Zoe, I would love for you to introduce yourself and we can get going
Zoey (00:48.75)
here.
Zoey (00:59.736)
Thank you so much, Samantha. I'm so excited to be here. I'm excited to speak to all of you and to get my message out. And I sincerely hope that it resonates. So my name is Zoe. I wrote a book on love and how to calculate love and also how to measure self-love and partner love and what happens when the scores are a match, what happens when the scores are quite different from one another, and how to build a healthy relationship.
based on that. So my background, my educational background is in criminology. But I actually, I'm a business owner, I'm an entrepreneur, and my side hobby has always been understanding love. And yeah, so I've been writing this book for about six years. I published it in November. It's available in Barnes and Noble now. So I'm just excited to get the message out because I sincerely think that it could help because it's helped me a lot.
And I've heard some really good reviews on it helping others with healing and just building self-confidence.
Savannah Rose (02:06.665)
Yes ma'am, well congratulations! I know it takes a lot to write and publish and release a book, so congratulations on your firstborn!
Zoey (02:10.072)
Thanks.
Zoey (02:16.12)
Thank you so much. Thank you. Yeah, it was quite a journey. This idea came to me back in college. So 18 years ago, 18, 19 years ago. And yeah, I just always kept it in my back pocket and I refined it over and over again. And eventually I validated the theory when I studied data analytics and through 300 surveys, I actually confirmed that I can in fact predict love, calculate love.
Savannah Rose (02:25.033)
Wow.
Zoey (02:44.404)
also heal relationships if something is misaligned.
Savannah Rose (02:49.255)
Wow, that's amazing. You already read my mind, because when I saw that you had your background in data and criminology, I'm like, those are two things that I don't feel like people will hear about enough, but would apply to something like love. Because I think love is, it confuses it to be strictly emotional. But I think that when you're really diving into a conscious partnership and that conscious self-love, that you have to have analytics. You have to use that.
that rational mind as well as your emotional mind.
Zoey (03:20.928)
Absolutely, I totally agree with you. know, love is such a beautiful emotion and there's nothing wrong with attaching spirituality to it. There's nothing wrong with an understanding of soul mates and soul contracts. But with that said, at the extreme, we start to romanticize relationships that are not healthy. So essentially this formula, it doesn't bypass emotions or anything. It just makes sure that you're making
sound decisions and smart decisions when choosing to engage with a partner. And I know for me, I was kind of falling into a pattern of not being connected to the right people. And I understood that I simply did not have the right values there where I was requiring a partner to show up for me as a rock, but also the trait preferences.
that I had listed had nothing to do with, well, I wouldn't say it didn't have anything to do with goodness, but I would say that they weren't necessarily conducive to a healthy relationship, right? Like age, for example, or cultural background, what does that have to do with a healthy relationship? So yeah, I would say that although there's quite, there's a lot of romance in love and a spiritual understanding and attachment to love.
does not mean that we can't make good choices in love.
Savannah Rose (04:49.129)
That's a that's so so well put I love that you explain it that way because I think that it's recognizing those patterns and it sounds like your expertise and your book really helped people reflect on the recognition of those patterns and how they can Move more from that subconscious place to that conscious place of making like making those choices and really reflecting on why they choose the people that they do and maybe Choosing people not realizing they're choosing the same
unhealthy things. I think it's so important to bring awareness to that.
Zoey (05:22.542)
Absolutely. In fact, back in 21, I was going through a pretty bad breakup and I applied the concepts of the book to this breakup. I'm like, why does it hurt so much? How can I heal from this? And I realized that my top five values were not in line with health, with a healthy standard in a relationship. So one thing we found from the data analytics is that people were consistently putting
honesty and dependability as their top value. I wasn't doing that. And why would I not do that? Don't you want a partner that's going to show up for you as a rock? So once I started to realize, no, this has to be a value. Otherwise I'm going to shoot myself in the foot, right? When I'm falling and engaging in partnership. Once I added that to my top values, I started attracting a completely different crowd. In fact,
As I was going through this breakup, I met someone at the dog park who's now my husband, right? Yeah, and that's because I switched around my values and beyond that I also changed my trait preferences. That's a little harder to change because that's a bit more inherent and it's more personality. It's more like what you're just inherently attracted to and you know, I mean sometimes you can't choose what you're attracted to, but I think just
writing it down just allowed me to gain a level of self-awareness that it's like, no, I want to step out of this self-harm because that breakup was just so bad. And I told myself, I am not doing that to myself again, right? So yeah, so I met Kevin. I'm like, well, the calculations work. So, and then lo and behold, we got married. And now I have a rock that I'm so attracted to that I laugh with.
And yeah, I'm just, it all comes down to that self-awareness and then making smart choices based on that.
Savannah Rose (07:25.989)
I love your story. That's so powerful and compelling and I think too like you really sparked my curiosity with how you were changing the preferences because I think I've seen this chatter about preferences being almost I would say confused with attachment like unhealthy attachments. I see some people who are in the dating pool who are like
having this incongruency with what they want versus like what they're putting up with for lack of a word. So I want someone who is X, Y, and Z. Those maybe are their preferences.
And then it's almost like trying to make a square peg fitting around hole where they have someone who maybe has some of those preferences, but when it comes down to their values or what they're really looking for in a partner, it's almost like they're overlooking the value side of things because those preferences are overruling. And I wonder, at least for what I've seen, the attachment piece has been a huge driver behind that overriding. I'm just curious what your thoughts are on that.
Zoey (08:34.488)
Yeah, I mean, you just touched on something very important in the book. There's a personality type that I identified. So when you lean more towards values, that's the practical personality type, right? That means that what drives your choices are more practical, i.e. you're looking at values, right? More than traits. When you're an emotional, that means that attraction will drive your choices, right? So between both sides, they're healthy,
There's the healthy personality type and the extreme personality type. That means that there are healthy emotionals out there where you're just slightly leaning towards trait preferences, but still very much taking values into account. And based on our data, this is actually the group that was able to sustain relationships longer. And then there's the extreme emotional. I used to fall in the extreme emotional personality type. Why? Because I was not paying attention to values the way I should have.
right? And I was like, well, this person just sparked something in me and I feel so drawn and my god, and they're so sexy and all of that and all of that, right? Super unhealthy. If it's taken to an extreme. So with that said, I totally agree with you. And there is a group of people that fall into this personality type where they are driven by by romanticizing of
Savannah Rose (09:48.553)
Great.
Zoey (10:01.742)
these emotions, right? And they call it the runner chaser, they call it soulmate contracts, they call it all these spiritual things, which I believe, like I believe, I'm a very spiritual person, I believe in that. But not to the extent where it's causing self harm. And if it is, then that soul contract is not keep self sacrificing, your angels do not want you to hurt yourself, right? That's not the point, in my opinion, of being here on earth, right?
And beyond that, if you do fall in that personality type, just to let you know, you're not likely going to hold onto that relationship because that's what our analytics showed, that it creates imbalance in the relationship. And unfortunately, you project unhealed behaviors, i.e. toxic behaviors within the relationship.
Savannah Rose (10:48.348)
Absolutely.
Savannah Rose (10:54.821)
Mm-hmm. Mm-hmm. yes. So well said. And I think that...
I mean something I teach a lot of my clients is, and you put this beautifully too, where it's like emotional always remains a part of it, but it's just about having that balance. Like you can lean a little more towards the emotional, but it sounds like if you're not able to have that self-awareness of how much like the emotions are driving you, something can be built, like the relationship can be built off of those emotional whims. And then as soon as the emotions change, like y'all go through a hardship or someone is acting differently.
or whatever the case may be, like those emotions shift, it's like, boom, that can be catastrophic for that relationship.
Zoey (11:31.544)
Mm-hmm.
Zoey (11:36.79)
Absolutely, absolutely. It's true. And the reality is that love feels so good. It's an ecstasy, it's a euphoria, but it can also border on emotional dysregulation. So if you feel that ecstasy easily, sadly, your emotions can very easily drop as well, right? So when you're emotionally dysregulated, you're more likely to fall into this extreme emotional bucket, right?
Savannah Rose (11:50.089)
Bye.
Zoey (12:06.286)
And I genuinely believe that we've all been there at some point. We've all been in love. We've all just, you know, like been consumed by thoughts of someone else, right? It happens. And I think that's a part of being human, right? But that said, I think it's very important to check yourself because if you don't check yourself and if you start running or falling in the spiral of God wanted it this way and my angels wanted it and there must be something meant to be, there's probably a meaning there.
Savannah Rose (12:22.045)
short.
Zoey (12:36.012)
I get that, but the longer you stay in there, the more you'll self-harm.
Savannah Rose (12:43.281)
Yeah, absolutely. That's so well put. Absolutely. And I agree with you. I'm also a super spiritual person. I mean, I have the lover's tarot card behind me.
Zoey (12:51.318)
I saw that. I saw that. I love it. I love it. I love tarot. It's like my my hidden passion that no one really knows about. This is the first time I'm telling people. Yeah.
Savannah Rose (13:03.439)
I'm honored. This is a safe space. Listen, I love the will. Bring on the will. Absolutely. Because I think, and as women, think that the intuitive practices, the spiritual practices, that's one of our birthrights to really fine tune and lean into. And I wanted to dive more into how you were describing the self-harm versus self-love aspect. I think that that's something that really stood out to me.
Zoey (13:08.771)
Yeah.
Savannah Rose (13:33.323)
when you reach out and also just in our conversation so far is how self-love is a key ingredient on this journey. I know I certainly have had to learn that and I would just love to hear more of your thoughts on your perspective on self-love and its influence.
Zoey (13:49.144)
Sure. So the way the framework understands self-love is how you show up based on your own standards, right? So this is what we call values in the framework. So if you pick your top five values, it could be purpose, it could be career, it could be a family, whatever it may be, right? You score yourself against each one based on how you feel you show up, and then you tally up that score.
And essentially whatever that total is it's a numerical assessment of self-respect and self-love Okay, here's what we found from the analytics if you have low self-respect self-love ie the self score You are not likely going to engage in a healthy relationship If you have high self score you are more likely to engage in a healthy relationship Especially if you also admire your partner. So the best relationship turned out to be when you're
Savannah Rose (14:41.726)
yeah.
Zoey (14:44.046)
partner was 4 % above you. That was the best relationship. If they were 5 % below you, sadly it seems like eventually it breaks down because if you were to interpret this number, it means that the admiration is not necessarily there. There might be a part of you that feels unfulfilled. So we found if it's 5 % lower for the partner, they tend to be on a break. If it's 10 % lower for the partner, it was a mutual breakup.
Savannah Rose (15:04.787)
Mm-hmm.
Zoey (15:13.312)
If it was 16 % lower, means they were broken up with, and then 25 % if they did the breaking up. All to say there's only one group that showed two high self scores, and that was the group that was currently together. I know that's a lot of analytics gonna turn your way. Okay, but to wrap up and interpret this info, it's...
Savannah Rose (15:31.807)
I'm loving it, yeah.
Zoey (15:37.11)
You cannot love someone else unless you love yourself. I literally numerically validated this. If you don't give yourself a high self score, you're not going to show up well. And the goal is not to lie to yourself, by the way. The goal is to ask yourself, why am I giving myself a 10 or half points for family? Am I being hard on myself or am I actually not showing up for family? How do I change this? How do I make myself?
the best that I can be and show up the best way that I can for family. Now, whatever your values are, you do the same for the other ones. What can I do? And at the end of the day, it is all self-perception. I realized four years ago when I was going through the awful breakup, I was really hard on myself and I was way too easy on him. So initially his score was 16 % above mine. And when I put pen to paper, I'm like, boy.
This is infatuation. This is not healthy. Why am I infatuated? It's not like this human should be that grand, right? So what ended up happening was I put things into perspective for myself and I told myself, this is not a score that I deserve. I deserve more than this. And I told myself, be easy on yourself. Don't be so self-critical. Also look at the reality. This person is not a rock.
Savannah Rose (16:40.125)
Mm.
Zoey (17:05.986)
Look at the reality, don't suffer from delusions. Maybe you had a few good moments here and there. That's not the net of what's happened. This was a net negative with him, not a net positive. All to say, sorry, a very big roundabout way of saying you can't love someone else unless you love yourself. You will not fall into a healthy relationship unless you love yourself. And there are ways to measure your self-love.
Savannah Rose (17:32.969)
my gosh, I'm just like give me a spoon because I just want to eat all of this up. I love it It's amazing. You're so brilliant. So you my gosh
Zoey (17:38.446)
You're so sweet. Thank you so much, Sabin.
Savannah Rose (17:43.153)
I'm being so for real. It's so fascinating that I can tell how much work and intention and thought you've put into this process. This deserves to pop off because it's so smart and it's so... mean, everything you're saying is like I can even just with my own background and experience, I'm like, wow, that's all being supported in my line of work. I'm just loving it. It's amazing.
Zoey (18:12.108)
I'm so glad it resonates. I'm very happy.
Savannah Rose (18:13.067)
You're
It does, it does. I think, mean, something I even teach my own clients, like to support what you're saying here is like you need a partner, not a project. Because I see, I think I see this, well, honestly, I see this balanced in all genders. But I think sometimes like this need that people have if they don't have that deserve ability installed yet and like they haven't embodied self-love fully, where they kind of can
use
being loved with being needed. And so when they kind of choose a partner who maybe they don't see as an equal, but someone that they can quote like fix, or like, maybe if I just work harder or do this, then I'll get the love that I want. And I feel like that's just such a downward spiral recipe because one, it's dehumanizing to that individual, the one who they are viewing as a project, but two, it's automatically setting them up to receive less.
And I just feel like that's really unfair to that individual. And it's, I think, a huge paradigm shift when you're able to recognize yourself, what you bring to the table, and know that you are proof that that can exist in someone else, and then seek out and attract that equal partner. So I think it's powerful.
Zoey (19:35.308)
Yeah. I mean.
Yeah, I mean, honestly, you're on point. In fact, I dedicate a whole chapter on this. It's called the self-sacrificer versus the self-focused dynamic. So when you relate this back to the framework, essentially you're saying I have my list of values, but rather than working on my self score, I'm going to work on the partner score.
So if I am rating, let's say again, going back to family, family as one of my top values rather than reaching out to my own family, making sure that I'm showing up for them, that I'm showing up as a daughter, as a sister, whatever it may be, I'm showing up for my partner's family or I'm encouraging him and making sure that he's bumping up his score within that, right? That's a self-sacrificer. And at the end of the day, the analytics also showed that if your partner sees you as less than them,
or if you see yourself as less in them, it's not gonna work. It's not gonna work. You're gonna start projecting behaviors within the relationship that are not balanced, that tend to be fueled by insecurity, right? And also kind of, yeah, yeah, insecurity.
Savannah Rose (20:55.593)
That makes sense. That makes a lot of sense. I'm curious, did you notice any patterns with, I guess, like themes that people would project on the others? I'm sure, like you mentioned, insecurity is a big one, but I'm curious, like, what other projections were common.
Zoey (21:12.182)
Yeah, the distortions were, it was very interesting for me to write about. There are a ton of distortions actually that I found. So one of them was the dependent versus the independent, right? So the dependent will assume that they need their partner score to boost their own score. So for example, if I really wanna get into entertainment, right? Rather than working on myself to get myself out there,
Savannah Rose (21:33.705)
Mm.
Zoey (21:41.624)
whether it's auditions or whatever, I may be looking for someone who's already reaching that entertainment status, the high status, and I'm latching onto their score. I become a dependent. I'm assuming that my value is based on their value. Does that make sense? And if they are an independent, that means that they're gonna get drained by me just latching on, right? And assuming I need them. Another one is the infatuation. This is when you score someone way above you.
Savannah Rose (22:06.236)
Yeah.
Zoey (22:10.434)
that is so not healthy. There's definitely something wrong there. There's no reason for anyone to be that much above you. And if for whatever reason they are, that's not a relationship that you're looking at. You're looking at a mentor. You're looking at, you know what I mean? They're not gonna see you the same, not in a balanced way, right? The hero distortion was another. This one is a highly manipulative distortion where let's say,
Savannah Rose (22:29.457)
Absolutely.
Zoey (22:39.148)
actually I'm gonna give you my own personal little example of this so yeah back in the day when I was writing the book I connected with someone who was very intelligent in LA and when I met him he said hey Zoe I can get this book for you like to like great heights right and I'm like that's interesting but I was always honest with him about where I stood with him romantically
Savannah Rose (22:43.881)
Yeah, I love it. Thank you for being here.
Zoey (23:09.28)
i was not interested in him romantically and i was very open about that, right? in the beginning i'm like, let me see, let me see but eventually i realized that i didn't want it, right? the moment that i was firm with him about not wanting anything romantic he was done done with me, right? yeah so the hero distortion essentially says that, hey, i have a high score here's what you need, let me be your hero
Savannah Rose (23:10.227)
Mm-hmm.
Savannah Rose (23:18.717)
Thank you.
Savannah Rose (23:29.428)
yeah, up in there, hmm?
Zoey (23:39.318)
right? This is a savior distortion, this is a false hero, it's highly manipulative, and if you don't feed their ego, they will just... they will poke at you so hard, you know, and unfortunately I've experienced this enough in my lifetime, not just for the book, right, but for other things, like whether it was career or whatever, you know what I mean? And now I just see it from a mile away, it's like this person is trying to flex their score, and they're trying to use their score somewhere that they know they're achieving
you know, a good amount of success and they're manipulating me. They're manipulating me into thinking that I need them. Does that make sense? So this was an interesting distortion that I uncovered. Yeah, there's literally a ton more that I could go through the list with.
Savannah Rose (24:19.817)
Savannah Rose (24:29.705)
Yeah, now I 100 % will have experienced that myself. remember, you're right, when you said you can see it a mile away now, it's something that almost has an odor to it. When you start to pick up on someone who's engaging in that kind of behavior and it's just...
It's almost like unnecessary ego, like spitting, where it's like, I mean, I love when people can share about themselves and I love a strong personality, but when it's just incessant details about stuff, I'm like, is this for a moment? I don't know. Yeah, I remember experiencing that.
Zoey (25:04.652)
Yeah, yeah.
Savannah Rose (25:07.589)
Yeah, and as someone who was trying to collaborate with me, we did collaborate on a couple of things, but I just noticed it was all this really big talk. was all a lot of big talk and a lot of talk about his, quote, intentions with me of like, I just want to be friends. I just want to be friends. I never want to make you uncomfortable. I just want to be friends. And I was just kind of like, if you just want to be friends, why are you telling me this 50 times? That's so weird.
Zoey (25:26.606)
Bye.
Savannah Rose (25:37.483)
And lo and behold, he saw me dating someone, contact over, gone, ghost, no business collabs, like nothing. And I'm like, happened to just being friends? So,
Zoey (25:49.448)
I know, yeah, no, happens for sure. And sadly, it works. It works with a lot of women. In fact, I gave the example in the book of, what was that director's name? Who's in jail now? My God, I'm Harvey Weinstein. Harvey Weinstein? Classic, classic. He has a very high score in entertainment. He knows it. He manipulated women over and over again.
Savannah Rose (25:57.598)
Yeah.
Savannah Rose (26:08.347)
yeah,
Zoey (26:18.522)
And sadly for them, they felt like that was their way to get into a very niche industry, highly competitive industry, right? What happens if this woman does not give in to their ego, into their demands? They were done, done from the industry. So I personally find this distortion to be a highly, not just manipulative, but highly controlling.
Savannah Rose (26:38.121)
Mm-hmm.
Zoey (26:45.986)
borderline abusive, right? Of course there's a scale in terms of how far they'll go. But yeah, I know for me personally, I, yeah, it's, you really need to be a strong person and under, and not like internalize that when they snap at you for not playing into their ego.
Savannah Rose (27:07.909)
Absolutely. And I think that bolsters up even more your support of the self-love aspect. Because I think if I had been, gosh, if it was me five years ago when I didn't really know what I brought to the table or I hadn't built the success that I've built for myself, because I knew from the very beginning, like, I don't need this person. I just knew. And I'm like, this could be fun, but it's not going to make or break anything for me. I'm just doing this because I thought it would be fun.
Zoey (27:35.458)
Yeah, I hear you.
Savannah Rose (27:38.633)
And I think that that was like my best leverage, but I had to get to that point. And so I think that that's something I would just encourage any listeners to look at and maybe even take an inventory of. I'm sure your book has something along these lines of just like identifying and bringing that self-awareness to like, what do you bring to the table and keeping that at the front of your mind. So you don't have to, like you said, like look for a hero.
Zoey (28:05.942)
Absolutely. And you're right, I do talk about that, how to rebalance the distortion. First and foremost, like, we have to pull ourselves out of assuming that we need anyone. No one can take your self score away from you. No one. But if you're depending on someone else's score to boost you up, that can very easily be taken away from you. Right? Yeah, sometimes it's a grind. That's what life is, right? But at least you know that that's secure.
Savannah Rose (28:21.449)
you
Zoey (28:34.222)
And also the way you show up when you feel secure, when you feel like you're showing up high based on your own standards, that glow, no one can take that glow from you. No one can take that calmness away from your voice and that solid center away from you. No one can take away your peace of mind if you feel so great about yourself. So all to say, work on you. It's so important. And watch people get attracted to you.
Savannah Rose (28:35.431)
Right.
Zoey (29:03.554)
work on you, like solidify your center and watch like you will be a magnet. You you will, you're an empress at that point, right? From the Tarot. That's the goal. That's the goal. You incorporate the queen of cups, the queen of pentacles, the queen of swords. Then what's the fourth, the queen of wands, right? And you become an empress. You literally have all those foundations to feel like, yeah, I got this, you know?
Savannah Rose (29:04.805)
Uh-uh.
Savannah Rose (29:13.686)
yes!
Savannah Rose (29:22.119)
Bye.
Savannah Rose (29:34.483)
So inspiring, so well said. I'm curious, and since you've revealed that you are spiritual and everything, I'm curious like your perspective on the yin and yang in these dynamics, like the masculine and feminine. Because it sounds like your book is a fantastic resource to build that masculine within ourselves of that analysis, of that protection, like that healthy protection within ourselves, like that ability to
create like that structure for ourselves which then I think allows us to melt into our feminine and to glow and to have that ease that attracts people our way. I'm curious like what your thoughts are on that.
Zoey (30:16.682)
Yeah, I mean, thank you for asking. That's actually a very unique question. I've never heard that question before. The way I understand feminine versus masculine is masculine is right brained. Yeah, right brain, right? So very logical, very structured, very like trying to understand whereas the left brain is creative. It's emotional. It's in flow, right? So I think with love, we tend to be more in flow, more like what does my heart
Savannah Rose (30:24.201)
Yes.
Zoey (30:46.53)
Right, what does my body want, right? This framework, I absolutely would agree that it's adding a masculine element to love. In other words, it's good to be in flow. Emotions are so important when you're connecting with someone. With that said, it has to make sense. And if you fall into patterns that don't make sense, you will experience.
you know, not the greatest experience, right? You may learn a lot, but I just, in my experience, if you don't make smart decisions, you're not likely going to fall into something that's healthy, that's fulfilling, at least not in the long run, right? So yeah, I do believe that this absolutely captures a masculine aspect of love. But again, this is not to dismiss the flow, it's not to dismiss
Savannah Rose (31:25.797)
Okay.
Zoey (31:39.316)
like the beauty of love, like your first dates and the flirtation and those butterflies and everything, right? If anything, it just says, hey, your brain is wired to create an offspring. We are still running by the reptilian brain. We're still humans. Evolution says that that is our core driving force, right, to have sex for the purpose of reproducing.
We're still bound by that. So when we see a partner that's either a match or slightly better, it's like body says, ooh, that's the one I want to have sex with. That's the one I want to have babies with, right? And these are very subconscious primal instincts. It's okay to not have kids. I don't have kids, right? But that primal instinct is saying, that's the one. That's the one I want, right? So then your body and your hormones start activating. Your oxytocin, serotonin, dopamine, it's all out of whack, right?
And that's great, right? But yeah, so as much as there's a very strong feminine element to love because it's so flowy, because it's so emotional, there's also an explanation to love. And if we understand the explanation, that means that we can start shifting our patterns in love if we feel that we keep falling into just unhealthy relationships.
Savannah Rose (32:35.463)
Right, yeah.
Savannah Rose (33:04.553)
Absolutely. Yeah, well said. That makes so much sense and I think it's so important to have a tool like your books to help you remain grounded, I think, in that process so you can fully embrace.
Zoey (33:05.954)
Thanks.
Savannah Rose (33:18.609)
the excitement and have it be real and have it not be something that is like you mentioned before like the infatuation piece like I know with my partner now like we're very serious we're not married yet but we're getting there but I just remember when we first started talking and dating like being so intentional about the analytics really of what were actually happening not just like how I was feeling or like the fantasies that play out my head because I'm like I'm super
Zoey (33:31.523)
Mm-hmm.
Savannah Rose (33:48.475)
romantic person. But I have often in the past let myself get very carried away with that.
Zoey (33:48.994)
Mm-hmm.
Zoey (33:53.422)
Mm-hmm.
Savannah Rose (33:55.739)
And so it was very much like a grounding of myself and staying mindful and present with like how he was actually showing up. And then of course, over time, like everything was matching up and I'm very grateful he's my partner and he's the best man ever. But I think that like, gosh, if it weren't for some of these lessons that we've learned, I would maybe still be on those old patterns and on that old path. So I think it's really important that you're covering like such a huge spectrum.
information. It's amazing.
Zoey (34:27.374)
Yeah, no, I really appreciate you sharing that. The reality is that we kind of grew up with movies and Disney movies and Hollywood movies thinking that love has got nothing to do with practicality and it's all like your emotions, right? Look at Aladdin and Jasmine. That was literally my favorite movie growing up, right? And that does not make sense. The scores were just...
Savannah Rose (34:53.243)
Yeah, yeah, he lied to you from the very beginning, girl. Like, okay, that's a risk.
Zoey (34:57.486)
Yeah, but that's what we learn, right? We learn about the Prince Charming who's, you know, all about love and nothing else matters and they're gonna fight for you and whatever. That is not what life is, right? Hollywood movies is not what life is. again, because love can be very addictive. It's beautiful, but that beauty is highly addictive. It can very easily border on obsession and again, just self-harm.
right? If you let yourself spiral. And now, thanks to the internet, now we have a lot of information online that can very easily validate dynamics that are not necessarily good for you. Like one of my favorite things to see online is the runner chaser. We are essentially romanticizing, saying, hey, this person doesn't want to be with you, but that's kind of, you know, it's what the angels wanted.
Savannah Rose (35:47.657)
and
Zoey (35:57.388)
I don't know if I totally believe that. We're dealing with someone who's an avoidant, who doesn't necessarily want to be with you, who's afraid of commitment. And I'm not saying all cases, I'm just saying that there's enough information out there where if you're experiencing something negative in a relationship, they're going to say, don't worry, don't worry, it's meant to be this way. You don't know, change it. Change your preference, change your values. This person is not good for you.
Savannah Rose (36:19.303)
Yeah.
Savannah Rose (36:24.169)
100 % yeah and I think that that self love piece comes with like that self awareness and just becoming aware of
attachment really and like how that can play a huge role because like especially with like the attachment types if someone's avoidant and maybe you're anxious and that avoidant behavior keeps triggering those anxious behaviors I think it can like lead us to telling this different story in our head but I think when we have these speed bumps these roadblocks like the guidance in your book and so forth it can help us kind of check like am I reacting to this person and that's becoming like my motivation to chase
Or are they meeting me halfway? Like are we actually connecting? I think that's really important.
Zoey (37:10.19)
Exactly, exactly. Are you doing all the legwork emotionally? If you are, you're gonna be drained, right? And again, as we know, that's not attractive to the opposite sex. If it is attractive, that means that you're falling in a dynamic with someone who's highly self-focused or in the extreme situation suffers from narcissistic personality disorder.
right, where they need to be kept on a pedestal to be happy in a relationship. And that's not what we want. We want to feel love. want, know, like love, like I said, is such a beautiful feeling. But if it's not reciprocated and you're doing all of the legwork, like you're gonna hurt yourself. That inner glow is going to dissipate. The way you hold yourself in conversations when you're out, when you're at work, it's like,
Savannah Rose (37:38.419)
Right.
Zoey (38:05.524)
you're going to collapse inside and that's going to show in your body language. It's going to take away attracting luck. It's going to take away your glow. And yeah, so I totally agree with you that, you know, like those behaviors, whether it's an avoidant and anxious attachment, like it needs to be checked. And also beyond that, it needs to be understood.
Savannah Rose (38:29.03)
Mm-hmm.
Zoey (38:32.85)
One thing that I found from the book and from the framework is that people who tend to be anxious, they have low self score, right? So the average for women was 76%. If you're below maybe like a 70%, you're likely going to fall under the anxious attachment style. If you're above an 80%, you're likely going to fall under secure.
Savannah Rose (38:43.081)
Bye.
Savannah Rose (38:53.385)
you
Savannah Rose (38:57.789)
Wow. I love...
just all the information, all the data. It just makes me so excited. Just because I think it's something that is so necessary for all types of people. Because one of the resources that I have created is a magazine that's dedicated to men and them understanding themselves and their mental wellness, as well as their sexuality and relationships. And I feel like this is going to be such a great resource to recommend to men specifically. mean, I think everybody under the sun will benefit.
But I'm excited to have this resource for men because I think
Men are so much more comfortable with analytics and not that women aren't, but think men, that's like one of their more natural languages that they're conditioned to. And so I think being able to relay this information in a way that's already kind of translated for what they're used to, I think is gonna really help a lot of these themes resonate. So I'm really excited to share this with people, if you can already.
Zoey (39:59.826)
Yeah. No, thank you so much. In fact, so with the framework, so when I was connecting with Kevin and I think we were on our sixth month of dating, we actually did the love formula together and we both had high scores for ourselves and, you know, the partner, right? So that was very positive. Now, I'll be honest with you, clearly marriage is not easy. There's been many moments of misalignment.
many moments where I was falling short in his eyes and he was falling short in my eyes. We ended up using this as a tool for communication. I think that men are very logical and they're very literal. Women, can read, I'm so sorry for the men. I feel that women can often read between the lines and I feel that we have...
two signals at play. have our AM signal, which is the verbal, and we have a very strong FM, which is, let's say, body language reading between the lines, right? We don't always get it right, but I do think that ours is stronger because we have high emotional intelligence, and I think that we pick up on energy, right? Men, bless you guys, from my experience, the signal AM is really strong, and sometimes the FM is just a little, you know, cranked down.
Savannah Rose (41:05.654)
I love that.
Zoey (41:23.138)
which is okay, right? But with that said, I found that using this framework to explain certain things to my husband, Kevin, has been very beneficial and also to understand how I'm showing up against his standards, his values, right? And that I got lazy. There are definitely moments where I got lazy with my communication and I could have been softer.
there were moments where he got a little lazy with the reliability aspect, right? So in being able to A, understand where we were three years ago and after getting married and you know, again, like it's not easy, right? You constantly have to communicate and you live with someone and sometimes you have a bad day and whatever. It's so important to come back and just
Savannah Rose (41:50.921)
short.
Zoey (42:19.15)
How do I put it? Not reset, but essentially come back, right? Like check in with one another, check in with one another. And actually what I found was we had allowed ourselves to get quite lazy to a point where there was like a 10 point difference.
which is not good because the analytics will show it's not sustainable. 10 point difference is not going to work. One of you will get frustrated, depleted, whatever it may be, right? So we both started working on getting better, right? Because we don't want to lose our marriage, right? So all to say for the men out there who are more logical, which is completely understandable because men can be quite literal, right? This is an excellent tool, A, to see if a person
Savannah Rose (42:57.011)
Yeah.
Zoey (43:08.842)
is a good match to you, but also if you're in a relationship, to get back to a place of alignment.
Savannah Rose (43:17.705)
I love that. I think that's so important and I think it's really exciting to have that baseline, that framework to model off of. Because that's something I see too, because I work with lot of folks in trauma recovery and in that realm, like a lot of trauma recovery and dating after abusive relationships, which I've experienced myself. And I have seen this with clients and with friends where it's like, if all they have ever known,
have been unhealthy relationships, whether it's like how they grew up and seeing their parents fighting or whatever it is, or they've just like continued in that pattern for so long because they didn't know any better, or they just don't know how to not be in that pattern. I sometimes see this like paralysis.
of not wanting to be in a relationship because they don't know how to be in a healthy one. Or maybe they do finally find a healthy partner and it just feels weird. I know I've experienced that with my partner too where it's like, I'm like, wait a minute, like I've had anxiety because everything is going so great. Because I'm like, wait a minute, like.
you still love me and you're okay with me being like emotional and you're okay with like I'll have those moments like not as much anymore but like I remember in the beginning it almost felt like too good to be true in some ways because I was just so used to that dysfunction and like that PTSD was still showing up. So I love that this is a resource for couples, for individuals and something that you can go back to time and time again I think that's so valuable.
Zoey (44:51.564)
Yeah, yeah. Well, I'm sorry to hear about your background, but it definitely sounds like there was self-awareness there and that you healed from it, right? And I understand like stability can feel very foreign. You know what I mean? Safety can at times feel boring, right? But at the end of the day, the flip side to that is the constant stimulation.
Savannah Rose (45:03.753)
Oh yes. Yeah. Appreciate it.
Savannah Rose (45:16.009)
Yeah.
Zoey (45:20.992)
is going to keep your nervous system on edge and the cons and the lack of predictability, the lack of, like I said, stability or having a rock there. Like it's going to keep you so much on edge that you're not going to be able to focus on those things that you value most in the world, whatever it may be, whatever it may be. And then you're so focused on like understanding your partner and it's like, what's going to happen today and all of that, right? It's so consuming and it's just, yeah.
Savannah Rose (45:25.938)
Right.
Savannah Rose (45:36.937)
Thanks
Zoey (45:50.624)
So I'm happy for you. I'm happy for you that you healed out of that and I can relate to that back in, you know, four years ago, five years ago, that's what I had to heal from and ask myself, why am I doing this? I was in my mid thirties and I essentially told myself, if you keep doing this, your soul is going to get crushed. like, you know, so I was over my own shit, excuse my language.
Savannah Rose (46:14.792)
Yeah.
Savannah Rose (46:19.465)
No, girl, it's so real and I've been over my own shit. Like that was my project last year. Like I took a year to just like get real and to just really practice. I kind of, I would say took it to an extreme. It felt like I took it to an extreme because I've been living so like compliant in that abusive relationship that when I did start setting boundaries and enforcing boundaries and...
say no to certain things or people because it wasn't aligned with my values. It was an adjustment, but I think ultimately it helped me attract my partner who I'm with today. So I feel you on that. But thank you for that. I really appreciate it. And I wouldn't change anything about my journey because it's led me to where I am today and who I'm with and our conversation right now. Also, I'm very grateful.
Zoey (46:59.042)
I don't
Zoey (47:07.886)
Yeah, yeah. And it sounds like you're very intelligent and you have a... Oh, I'm sorry. I'm sorry. I think I just cut you off. Sorry. I think it cut out a little bit and I cut you off. I was just going to say it sounds like your journey has set you up for very high empathy and understanding. And also, like, it sounds like you're a healer. I don't know that people can be healers unless they actually go through it.
Savannah Rose (47:18.695)
No, you're fine, you're good.
Zoey (47:35.534)
but the way you express your voice and your message, the way like, yeah, like I feel the softness in you, right? So it sounds like you've really channeled those experiences into a ripple effect of love and healing in the world. That's my take from what I hear.
Savannah Rose (47:45.609)
Savannah Rose (47:57.565)
Well, I'm blushing. Thank you. I appreciate that. And it's definitely like my purpose to be a healer. And I had to understand the value in that too and how I couldn't, because I think for some time I kept attracting people who needed healing and who doesn't need healing. But again, I had to move out of that paradigm of projects to partner as well. And of course my partner and I, we've healed each other in many ways. Like I know, for example, you mentioned a second ago with like that
Zoey (47:58.843)
Yeah.
Savannah Rose (48:27.593)
the framework being a baseline, that's something that I think in our own way, I can't wait to read your book to just learn more and all the details, but I think in our own way we kind of have this adoption of a framework where we're both just learning how to communicate and do that reset. I think just a...
Zoey (48:48.056)
Mm-hmm.
Savannah Rose (48:50.875)
A week ago or so, I was upset about something, but I've taken time to understand that I need time to regulate before I bring something to him. Otherwise, I become too dependent on the conversation to regulate me. And that's something that he's also adjusting to, because I think he's used to having...
partners who will just like blow up or react. And so when I'm over here being miss mindful, like we'll talk soon, but I need a minute. It kind of put him on pins and needles because he is used to like things just like happening so fast. And then where I'm doing the opposite, it was an adjustment for him, but I'm excited to learn more. And again, dive into those details in your book, because I think it's going to be great for us to continue to build upon as well as like share my audience to you. You have like
Zoey (49:27.246)
Mm-hmm.
Savannah Rose (49:41.387)
such valuable information and it's so cohesive as well. think it's amazing. So think everything you've mentioned so far could be its own book, but the fact that it's a masterpiece and it's all interwoven is so cool.
Zoey (49:55.288)
Thank you. Thank you so, much. I really appreciate that I've had the chance to kind of talk about it. You're right. It is a massive framework. And I've touched on like the key pieces, but it all ties in together. It all ties in together. And at the end of the book, there's actually this epilogue where I talked about like going through my journey of healing through the breakup from a few years back and how I met Kevin, right?
But actually I also wanted to touch on what you said. So Kevin and I, have the same dynamic as you and your partner. I enjoy space because same thing, right? With the emotional regulation. I think in the beginning, because he's someone who really needs to like, figure it out in that moment, right? He like, he doesn't like that space because it puts him on edge, right? He just wants to solve it right away.
This was actually quite a journey for us in terms of understanding what we need from each other. So we had to meet each other halfway. Now he meets me in the sense where he understands if I need space to just let it be, but I also don't take advantage of that space. And rather than huffing and puffing and going off and just letting it fester, I calm myself and I actually take that space to actually work on myself so that I can show up sooner.
Savannah Rose (50:52.296)
Yeah.
Savannah Rose (51:17.982)
Yeah.
Zoey (51:18.958)
And also kinder because my communication absolutely, there were moments where it was slipping and then I was projecting that into the relationship. He was projecting his crap into the relationship. And yeah, but again, like getting into a place of alignment and understanding each other and keeping nervous system calm, calm and understanding that for each other too, I think has been super beneficial. And it sounds like you're having the same journey with your partner as well.
Savannah Rose (51:48.457)
Definitely, yeah, I'm super grateful and it's been so magical chatting with you Zoe. I'm curious, was there anything that I, because I know I asked you million questions, was there anything that you just had on your heart that you would like to share?
Zoey (52:04.866)
Yeah, I think.
And guys, like, and by guys I mean everyone, right? Guys and girls, like, your heart is so precious beyond your heart being so precious, you are so precious. Unless you recognize that in yourself, you're not gonna show up positively in the world. And I understand wounds, I understand a lack of self-confidence, I understand rock bottoms, I understand all of it, okay?
but I also understand that if you allow yourself to stay there for too long and you don't utilize your brain and your mind to your benefit, especially in terms of your self perception and how you show up, you know, my, I'm afraid that you're going to continue to fall into patterns that are not healthy. And by the way, even when you do find that perfect person, don't assume that the work is done. Right.
Yeah, exactly. It's really not like we have fallen, my husband and I have fallen into toxic patterns within our marriage, you know what I mean? But again, the key is to get yourself back to a place of understanding that you are precious and the things that you offer to the world, it's precious and you are doing the best that you can and just give yourself grace.
Savannah Rose (53:06.724)
wait.
Zoey (53:30.124)
Believe that in yourself. If you believe that in yourself, you will show up differently at work, in your relationships, within your family, and all of that.
Savannah Rose (53:44.915)
Well said, it's so beautiful. Absolutely, I cannot agree more. think that it's before we can really receive what we're looking for. We have to believe that we deserve to receive it and that's that inner work for sure.
Zoey (53:57.806)
Yeah, absolutely, absolutely.
Savannah Rose (54:02.973)
Thank you again, Zoe. And how can folks get in touch with you and track you down for more wisdom and get your book?
Zoey (54:06.83)
Sure. Yeah. So if you guys want to learn more about the analytics, you're welcome to hop on luffcaninfactbecalculated.com. The book is available on Amazon and Barnes and Noble. If you're in Southern California, you can pick it up from the Spectrum Barnes and Noble location or Huntington Barnes and Noble location. Beyond that, you can find me on Instagram and TikTok at ZoeSharif.
And I think that's it.
Savannah Rose (54:39.497)
Amazing. Well, I'll make sure to drop all those links in the description so it's easy for y'all to touch base with her. But Zoe, I just wish I could give you a big ol' I loved it.
Zoey (54:47.015)
well, likewise. Thank you so much. You've been so sweet and such an incredible host. I really appreciate it.
Savannah Rose (54:55.645)
My pleasure, truly. It was so great to connect. Thank you again for reaching out and everyone, thank you for listening, tuning in, watching. Have a great rest of your day. I'm Savannah Rose. This is Eclipse Evolution and we have had the amazing Zoe Sharif today. Thank you all so much. Thank you again, Zoe, and take care everybody. Love yourselves, okay? Do it. Bye.
Zoey (55:13.486)
Bye guys.
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